- Meeting Notes
- What are Roots, and who do they benefit?
- Will any yield from the betting markets be paid back to Root holders?
- Is it accurate to say; if you want to use Beanstalk as a deposit then use the Silo, but if you want to it for utility then mint Roots?
- Is there a difference between someone buying Roots with Ether and someone else Minting Roots with Silo Deposits from a couple of months ago?
- What is the Beanstalk SDK and how does it add value to the Beanstalk ecosystem?
- What functions can be used with the SDK?
- What do we need to do to increase turnout for Beanstalk University?
- What is the status of the Pod Market?
- What is Publius spending most of their time thinking about recently?
- When will the next protocol built on top of Beans be released?
- Updates on Wells
- Discussion with Nasjaq
What are Roots, and who do they benefit?
- Roots are a Silo wrapper token
- People in the Beanstalk Silo may be interested in using Root as a collective Farming venue, where someone deposits their assets in the Root contract and anyone can call the Mow() or Earn() functions
- With the Root contract, you now have an ERC-20 token that has exposure to Beanstalk growth
- If you have Silo Deposit Publius thinks you will find more benefit in the collective farming functionality
- If you do not have a Silo Deposit the utility of the token will benefit you more
Will any yield from the betting markets be paid back to Root holders?
- Not exactly, but the concept is you could get additional yield with your Root tokens by providing liquidity for the Paradox Markets. Right now Roots yield is only from Beanstalk
Is it accurate to say; if you want to use Beanstalk as a deposit then use the Silo, but if you want to it for utility then mint Roots?
- Publius thinks it depends on the time horizon, in the short term this is probably true, but long term it is unclear.
- If you are a borrower, you do not want to borrow in a currency that is increasing in price. This is why things should be denominated in Beans as opposed to Roots
- In the future, if you pay for something with an older deposit you should be receiving more for your extra Grown Stalk
- Publius thinks there are a lot of advantages to the Stalk system and ideally, the Beanstalk ecosystem takes Grown Stalk into consideration
Is there a difference between someone buying Roots with Ether and someone else Minting Roots with Silo Deposits from a couple of months ago?
- When you mint Roots, the Roots that you receive are a function of the minimum change in the BDV, Stalk, and Seeds of the contract as a percentage of the BDV, Stalk, and Seeds when you perform the Mint.
- To avoid slippage when you mint, the only way to do it is Mint with Bean Deposits from the optimal season. If you have Bean Deposits that are older than the optimal average season of Deposit, you may need to buy fresh Beans and then Deposit them right away. That will lower your average season of deposit. If your Silo Deposits are too new, then you will have to buy older Silo Deposits.
- Beanstalk has different Silo Deposits with different BDV to Seed ratios, and just like how there is an optimal average season, there is also an average Seed per BDV ratio.
- When you are minting Roots from a Beanstalk Deposit, the UI will be able to mint from the most efficient Silo Deposit
What is the Beanstalk SDK and how does it add value to the Beanstalk ecosystem?
- An SDK is an easy mode for building on complex things. If you want to build on top of Beanstalk there are two ways to do it. The first is to call the contracts yourself, but you really have to know the contract. The second is to use an SDK. The SDK complies the harder functions to call into something that is much easier for a developer to work with
What functions can be used with the SDK?
- Right now it is a work in progress, what you can do now is not a reflection of what you can do in the future. As of today, you can get internal and external balances, perform swaps, Farm function, and the Pipeline. It is a workflow builder that you can put together. Workflows within Beanstalk are called the Farm and workflows outside of Beanstalk are called Pipeline.
- If you have any questions about the Beanstalk SDK reach out to AlBean on Discord
What do we need to do to increase turnout for Beanstalk University?
- Today’s class’s poor turnout is due to Thanksgiving
- To increase Discord metrics, people have to have a need to come to Discord. This means we need more exposure to Beanstalk in general
What is the status of the Pod Market?
- Publius does not know the answer to this question, but they think it is off
- Mod323 thinks it is back on after EBIP-6
- SiloChad confirms that it is back on
What is Publius spending most of their time thinking about recently?
- They are thinking a lot about the next three layers of protocols from an economic model that will not hurt Beanstalk. Lending protocols are currently not free of manipulation. There are a ton of markets that are getting built on top of Beanstalk. Publius thinks it is really interesting how everything fits together.
When will the next protocol built on top of Beans be released?
- If you mean developed within the Beanstalk ecosystem there should be stuff releasing Q1 2023
Updates on Wells
- There is no update
Discussion with Nasjaq
- There have been a lot of Bug reports around Beanstalk, security should not be assumed no matter how much it has been audited
- There is a balance between mitigating risk and creating new risk
- Publius thinks after an audit maybe release it to a bug bounty program before proposing on-chain
- The implementation of Seraph, the Seraph committee has been working around the clock to implement this
- At the margin, Beanstalk needs to bring in more Farmers to help out around the Farm
- Publius thinks it is a great time to build
- Nasjaq points out that the vibes are different from last year
- Publius points out that the things that matter are doing really good
- Who is calling the Sunrise() function
- Publius does not know, there are one or two bots who are calling the function
How's it going for this?
It's going odd. How are you.
Going? Well. I was just saying, you know, people are going to gather for Thanksgiving, so I guess we're all more or less kind of busy with that.
While we're here. Now.
You were here in the U.S. Everyone was with us. Thank you for joining. And, you know, guilty or not, all those good questions upon download chat from now and I think maybe most of these discussions is going to revolve around road and on the road to come. And I wanted to spend some time and ask a few questions that, you know, maybe, maybe answer or explain a little bit more about the road talking.
So the road talking as a silo deposit trap is what that is, is that it's basically wrap it around the side of deposit and that makes it fungible and it can be used, you know, as an axis when it's looking. My question is for three different let's say people have parties, someone who has no side of deposits. So, you know, and doesn't know about being stuck but, you know, came across the road talking and then someone who has a side of deposit and you know, once to transfer it or wants to issue a road token and then someone who has a side of deposit but, you know, has no interest in road at all whatsoever.
What does the road talking mean to those three parties.
To say so I think that perhaps maybe a fourth party is is necessary because the parties without siloed deposits, I think you sort of implicitly make it seem like they are maybe interested in routes, but you bifurcated the people that already have siloed deposits. So first, let's talk about why anyone might be interested in route, but the the general concept is that there's some yield associated with holding the root token.
Now in in reality that yield is almost exclusively derived from being stock. And therefore, if we start with the second half of theoretical potential participants that you mentioned of silo depositors, people that are in the beanstalk silo may be interested in using route as some sort of collective farming venue where people can put their deposits into a contract and then farm those assets that are in the token contract collectively and or share the the farming rewards evenly, which in practice effectively just spreads out gas costs associated with farming.
But the trade off is that upon redemption, anyone can redeem any set of the deposits within the within the contract. Now there are certain rules in order to to ensure that people are not able to remove excess value from the contracts. But I guess the point is that the trade off is which deposits you actually own. That is that is the one thing that is unclear.
But the gas costs, the farm then become spread out across everyone that is sharing this pool of deposits underneath the contract and therefore that that may be what is attractive to people that are already in the silo. Now, in addition to that, once you have this contract that performs collective farming, the contract actually issues a token which is fungible.
And as we all know, currently, at least the majority of Defi runs on on the ERC20 standard. And the result is that the lack of fungibility for silo deposits makes them difficult to use throughout DEFI, but perhaps it'll be a lot easier to use roots which are are a fungible wrapper around the deposits stratified. And so if we look at the paradox launch, for example, there are some markets there that are denominated in, in roots.
And so someone may want to separate from the collective farming enabled by the root contract, use the root tokens throughout DEFI to do various things like sports betting or, or lending and borrowing potentially, although that's currently known live to our knowledge. So that that's why it may be interesting now whether or not you have siloed deposits already perhaps plays into what what you view as the utility of the root token.
If you have siloed deposits. It's it's I mean we're we're totally making this up here. But it's probably more likely that you find immediate benefit in the collective farming functionality, although it's hard to understate that sports betting in roots is sort of the first outside utility for beans whatsoever. So as a silo deposit or a team, hard to understand how there's a lot of benefits gained from from from using the roots.
But, but the collective farming is interesting in and of itself, whereas you can imagine that for people that currently don't have any bienstock exposure or any silo deposits, that the utility itself, what you can do with those roots is actually what creates a little bit more of something that's attractive for you to potentially use or participate in. So not sure.
Sure, if that's helpful.
That is great. I thank you for taking the time to go in depth into each of these. So probably as you said, that most of the deal that comes to the router right now is, you know, some beanstalk. But right now and let's say that comes from the betting markets, that's also going to be distributed to the two technologies holders.
Well, not exactly. And I think there's a little bit of noise coming from your own, not just for reference, but the concept is that you can potentially get additional yield with with your root tokens, I guess, by providing liquidity, because the paradox is bet to earn concept, but that's not really yield in the sense of value accrue rule to the root token.
That's more using your root tokens in another protocol in a way that that accrues value. Whereas the point is that roots themselves currently generate yield that is exclusively from Beanstalk and the actions of users minting and redeeming root.
Okay. And apologies for the noise as a synergy problems.
It's a little better come.
All right. So obvious, would you say. Is it accurate then to say that, you know, if you want to use being just as a deposit, then of course you can put it on the silo. And then if you want to use it as a currency in its maximum, let's say, utility or value, then you would use it as a root token.
Is that like accurate or.
Well, it depends over what time horizon. I think in the short term that's probably true. But you also can't really use it as a currency either. So it's it's not exactly the best statement. If you think about how the Beanstalk ecosystem works at scale, I think that it's likely that the value that is transacted through the being economy is denominated in names as opposed to roots.
And the reason for that is that there is a demand within the market to have a stable value asset, whereas the root token is likely to increase in value over time in a relatively stable fashion. But those are sort of fundamentally different economics propositions and when it comes to an economy that's based in in credit and not even talking about Beanstalk as a need for money, but more talking about a credit based economy developing on top of the new stock.
If you're a borrower, you don't really want to be borrowing assets denominated in a currency that's increasing. Now, it's unlikely in practice that you're going to be able to borrow for much less than the silo yield. But the concept is that the in practice you wanted to nominate the debt in something that's as low volatility as possible, even if there's interest on top of the debt that factors in the growth of of the silo position or the silo yield.
But from a just denomination perspective, you'd expect at least I think we're right, this is our current or current opinion. We could be totally wrong on this, but we would expect most long term economic activity to be denominated in being as opposed to.
I agree with you. I think you raise a good point especially and of course, you know, the point of it is that you need a stable asset.
But that kind of assumes liquidity for silo deposits and that's hopefully not too far away. And I think we've talked about this before. Maybe not. But you can almost imagine in a world where commerce is happening in beans, that there is some sort of grown stock discount or like a bonus for paying with growing stock, where instead of paying with the beans themselves that you just purchase, if you pay with a bean deposit that it's older and therefore has additional grown stock on top of it, you'd expect to be compensated for paying with an older deposit so that now all of this requires a lot of infrastructure and you'd want the UCS to be really
clean and generally abstracted, such that the complexity of the accounting for silo deposits is generally abstracted from your normal user. But the, the economics here are actually really quite compelling where the silo does serve its it's sort of natural function as a savings account where in addition to the deep being interest that you're receiving, you're also receiving grown stock over time.
And then that grown stock actually allows you to, to, to earn or spend the additional value however you want to think about it within the bean ecosystem if you're going to spend those deposits. So very, a lot of different ways that this likely plays out. But there's a lot of beauty in the stock system. And in a perfect world, you'd have a a bean economy that highlights that or takes full advantage of it, as opposed to totally abstracting it underneath something like a rude token.
To be frank, think that the root token is really cool but is a little bit of a stepping stone to where the goal is ultimately to go. But in order to really have the the level of sophisticated markets necessary to support the bean economy denominated in beans, there's a lot more tech that needs to get built. And again, given that all defi basically runs on the ERC20 standard, at the moment, there is an immense amount of value in having a fungible wrapper for solid deposits and therefore very excited by by what root has created.
Maybe my last question about Ruth is now about Ruth handles, let's say, somebody's issue of be ready to talk to seeds. What does this mean to, let's say, you know, a farmer, a new farmer who wants to buy some Ruth tokens, let's say, you know, they're holding a farm, they want some of those techniques. And then others will have, you know, all side of deposits, let's say, from like two or three months ago.
So is there any difference to either of them? What should they look at? You know, how is it this cultivated.
Yeah. So so to review the this particularly with regards to minting when when you mint roots the roots that you receive is a function of the minimum of the change in the B.V. stock and seeds of the contract as a percentage of the of stock and seeds of the contract when you when you perform your mint and what that basically means is that if so so let's first consider the base case which is just being deposited in theory.
The root token has been implemented in a way where it's so generalized it can support beans and LP tokens, but the current root token just supports beans. What this means in practice is that all the bean deposits have the same seeds. So let's throw seeds out the window for a second. But when, when, when you deposit, when you take your being deposits and you mint roots, the concept is that root as a contract has a stock to body ratio, which means the contract has a certain amount of stock and a certain amount of beans, and that ratio corresponds to a certain season of deposit.
That stock to be in ratio corresponds to a specific season of deposit within the silo. And in practice what this all means is that in order to receive no slippage, forfeit no value to other root holders when you meant the only way to do that is to mint roots using being deposits that the average season of deposit is the optimal season.
So if you have been deposits and you have a silo deposits that are older than the optimal average season of deposit, in order to have no slippage, you may need to buy fresh beans, deposit them immediately, and then that that average that will lower your total season, average season of deposit to the average optimal rate. Now you may also have the average season of deposit of your current deposits, even if you have solid deposits may be too low, in which case there's going to be some slippage and there's not much you can do about it other than buying or being deposits, which again, because there's not currently a secondary market for solid deposits or or
any market for solid deposits, in fact, that's not so easy. So similarly, that applies to people that are buying beans, depositing them, and then minting routes where there's there's really no way around this stock to be the problem. So the the concept is that and understand that already because of the growing stock that routes accrue and that this is becoming a problem for you ruminants.
Interestingly this this this presents a pretty unique at least for the short term until a deposit market opens up a pretty unique opportunity for siloed depositors to effectively provide liquidity for route. And I believe that a bean route uniswap V3 pool has been deployed and the concept is that in theory you can sell your you can mint routes if you have an average optimal season of deposit, which if you have older deposits, you can, you can you can buy beans to get to the optimal season of deposit.
You can mint routes and then basically sell those routes with some premium to the BTV, but some discount relative to the grown stock discount. And the idea is that, you know, instead of right now, I think the slippage is like 5% that you can get. You know, there's some I don't know if it's an arbitrage per say, but there are some value that can certainly be created for the new route mentors by current siloed depositors by basically the current siloed depositors, even if they're not going to use the routes, mint the routes, and then sell them to the people that are going to mint them.
So not sure what the exact status is on that that uniswap pool, but no, that that was the plan in order to try to alleviate some of the the minting friction here and and think that's a pretty, pretty interesting solution. Now, this is the first time that there's been a Uniswap V3 pool in the ecosystem. So it will be interesting to see how it plays out.
And as has been discussed previously, there are no plans to incorporate Uniswap v3 into the silo at the moment, but nonetheless it'll it's an interesting opportunity or way potentially for people that have silo deposits to to maximize yield without using routes. But again, then you also have to consider the fact that when you're now taking the value that you receive for selling the routes, you do have to.
Then basically in order to loop it, you'd have to mint new deposits. At some point you do run out of all deposits and so it's unclear what the the max supply of routes will be here. But I think it's it'll be interesting to watch play out. Now to kind of answer your question completely mod is the seed angle.
So bean start has different silo deposits that are have different seed to BDC ratios. And in the same way that there's an optimal average season of deposit, there's also if if the token has more than one seed per BTV deposit supported and there's also an average seed per BTV ratio if you will. And so if the contract had alpi tokens and beans, there would be some optimal ratio of LP deposits and being deposits to add in order to to mint routes in order to minimize the slippage associated with the the seed to BTB ratio.
If that makes sense.
No, it does. This is very interesting to see how it unfolds. And I agree with you that there is an arbitrage opportunity there just given the route being taken, that will change to be something that, you know, could be or would be. I'd expect it to be a lot of publicity. Also, see, I don't know, actually. I mean, this is already how does it with the route you are when you mint from a deposit like bitcoin, maybe the most efficient deposit and start with that.
That's something that could be done.
So I'm not sure on the exact status of that. But our understanding is that that work is actively being done such that that that's possible. I think that then if it is, live it. To our knowledge it wasn't necessarily working perfectly yet, but it is that is is is a a short term goal to get up and running such that it the website automatically uses the most efficient deposits to minimize slippage and I just don't want to comment on the status without knowing it explicitly.
It's great just to know that this is going to be been considered really incredible to see all of, you know, all of what's being done and the details on it in such a short time.
Yeah, don't want to get ahead of ourselves, but know that at some point in the not too distant future, the hope is to have some sort of advance onset user interface that actually shows users based on their different combinations of deposits and optimization algorithms in terms of selecting different types of deposits, the slippage ratios that they'd receive over different volumes and yadda, yadda.
So the hope is to have a really helpful set of tools for people using.
More informative UI.
Stuff like that. That's a lot of work. So don't know exactly the timing, but know that it's, it's, it's actively being worked on now.
I guess the important thing that it's that is an easy to talk to now it's actually being used all of this other things are like efficiencies or improvements. Okay, I'll give it a minute. If anyone here has a question about it or through talking. And maybe the other two things I quickly wanted to discuss. This is the Beanstalk SDK.
What does this mean and what what value does it give? It to manage to see if anyone has a question about them can do that.
So Albian is is in the chat and they've been doing some amazing work on the SDK. Maybe they want to come up here and just talk a little bit about it.
Yes, I see them. Do you wanna do you want to come up and ask a few questions maybe about the SDK? It is it's hands. I.
I can you hear me.
Thank you. Are muted. Let's see.
That's this. Can you hear me okay?
How's it going?
Good, good, good. So what's going on? I guess the questions. Are you going to ask? Some questions are.
Starting off with the status of the Beanstalk as the sort we understand that, you know, you're going to work or you know you work on as can now it's out on life. My question is, you know, maybe what is the beanstalk as the kid? Why was it built? And, you know, how can it be leveraged or utilized or used?
Awesome. Yeah, great question. So for people that are not developers, basically an SDK is kind of like an easy mode for building on top of complex things, right? So if you're if you're a developer and you want to build on top of Beanstalk, well, there's two ways to do it. One, you can call the contracts directly, but that involves really knowing the hell out of the system.
Right? Like really, really, really knowing all the contract methods, what they do, all the conceptual stuff, how to put things together. And there's some easy things, right? Like you can just call sunrise. It's very easy. Just call it. You can even do it from either skin. But then there's some really complicated things, right, where you might want to like do some deposits or convert or things like that where you really have to both know the contracts, know what to how to call them.
And then sometimes you even have to like do some computations between calls, right? So if you're a very, you know, senior developer and you want to do it all manually by yourself, great, you can do that. That's kind of what we're doing internally in the UI. But if you want to make a developer's life easier, you basically create an SDK that wraps this stuff.
So instead of the developer having to do all the stuff manually, they just say SDK, dot deposit or SDK that meant or SDK that is right. So that's what it does. It just creates an interface that's very easy and friendly and behind the scenes it does all the complicated things.
Thank you. So you've mentioned a few things that could be used. What are those deposit? Can I call to summarize or designate? For example, you said convert as well as what other things can I do with it?
So right now it's working prior. So so what you can do now isn't necessarily a reflection of what you can do tomorrow, right? But to answer your question in two ways what you can do today and what we want you to be able to do once we release version one effectively, right? So as of today, we've built in a couple of features, right?
So you can get balances, internal balances, external balances, you can perform swaps. The swap functionality is actually more advanced than the UI we can do swaps between any supported pair. Unlike in the UI, there's some combinations that you just can't do. For example, I forget after my head, but with the SDK, literally any pair will work among itself.
So for now, you could, you could trade like USD 2 to 3 curve if you wanted to or being been to anything. Right, any, any of the tokens that are that we support. So we have a really, really robust swap mechanism. We put a lot of effort into the farm function and into this new pipeline function. Right, because these are the things that root and paradox would have needed to to basically enable their systems to work.
So a lot of time and effort went into that system and that is probably some of the most complex code that I've ever worked on, to be honest with you. But to give you guys a rundown, it's effectively a workflow builder of steps that you can put together, right? So those steps could be contracts within sorry, contract calls within Bienstock.
We call that the farm or that can be steps on any contract anywhere in Etherium. Right. So for that kind of workflow, we call that the pipeline. That's the new thing that Chad and Publius released. So the SDK kind of helps people build and compile these steps, these actions, into a workflow, right into a workflow that we call pipe orange or workflow that we call for, whether it's a internally executable against Bienstock.
So a form function or external. And the SDK really just simplifies a lot of putting that stuff together. In fact, when you go to the root website and you, you know, you mint some root behind the scenes, it's actually executing one of our workflows through the SDK. So for example, like if you if you picked East behind the scenes, there's a workflow that does is to wrapped is swap then not a swap but wrap a wrapping these to wrap these then a swap from wrapped is to usdc using the tri crypto port and then from USD T to being using our pool, right?
Like our three car pool. And then once you have the being it'll, it'll attempt to deposit it into sorry it'll mint root and kind of simplifying it here but it'll mint root and then all deposits root. So that's like a workflow that happens on there on the, on the root site.
That's clear. And thank you all for explaining it in details. You said that maybe if you're not familiar with the Beanstalk code, you would reduce that. But I think that even if you are just having the SDK allows you to do a lot of shortcuts. So as you said, an example is, you know, those different Android are utilizing modules investigating.
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, once the key is built, there's no reason to build to do things manually or the hard way. Right. So a lot of times these things are built even to help internal development. So that's that's the hope eventually where we're going to we're going to be rebuilt or not rebuilt, but swap out some of the functionality in the UI using the SDK and just have the SDK as the central development point for implementing new features.
And that helps the UI for us and it helps other developers as. Same time.
Thank you for those who are following the as the key can be based on finishing that is it going to be listed on the docs will just have its own you know link.
So right now everything would be in the in the repository in the GitHub repo that would be the central location. And then as far as docs, there's some links there, but it's not fully fleshed out. So that's also a work in progress. But I would start with the repo and if you have any specific questions, just find me on on discord.
More than that, it help.
Thank you. Thank you very much. Okay. What would it be? And maybe of the questions of the things that I want to discuss, we give it a minute as any of those are here, maybe have a question that they want to ask otherwise, we've called the class.
I think I see Nasdaq dropped a question.
Maybe in the general chatter. I don't see it.
I think it was in general.
Yeah, I see it now. So he asks, What do we need to do to increase turnout for classes? Maybe in a discord matrix? I think today's class could be two things. One is, you know, most probably just for Thanksgiving, but it's going to be also because we changed the timeline. Otherwise, we typically have like a consistent follow to of no to class in general.
What can we do to increase discord metrics that are probably has to be like that as a reason for you know people wanting to come to this court and for that for something which is maybe they found out about being stuck. We want to ask a question or have something specific where they want to join the community. So then your question is, how do you increase?
I would exports an agenda on on and on what we're doing. Let me just see if that's the question. So, yeah, so again, is, you know, discord is mostly a where we let's say invite everyone who come up and we talk to about being succinct, using those who come to discord. You just want to talk more about, you know, music itself, you know, and sure that, you know, whatever.
But we're going with you know, we're talking about it. I don't explaining or saying it to others. Okay. Tell about asks what's the state of the pod market? It doesn't seem to appear to be a lot of activity lately.
I actually don't know the answer to this one, but I think it's off. Is that right?
I think it was off, but it's back on after year six. Is that not true? I think it goes back now.
I hate to say it. I do not know.
Yes I had a chat confirms it's it is on you know they're working on some subgroups so maybe that's why it's not getting updated. Another I'm not sure if I answered the question if you would like to come up because you know there's this deal. So can, you know, talk more about it? Nozick asks what is spending most of their time thinking about lately?
The great question on this and spending a lot of time thinking about what the what the next let's call it three layers of protocols from an economics perspective that are most likely to to help in stock that's supposed to hurt it. And in particular, not sure how closely people do following all the drama around the short on, are they?
But current lending protocols are clearly totally manipulation resistant and a lending protocol is obviously something that's going to exist on top of being stuck at some point and in addition, just thinking about thinking about the exchanges effectively. And there's a lot of different like types of markets that are likely aren't even likely, as we understand, are being built at this point, not just wells, but a lot of different markets that are all being built by routes, developing some markets.
So there's just stuff. There's a lot of different interconnected pieces that ultimately to at least personally, the thing that I find most interesting is how all this stuff fits together and it's it's both like a constantly challenging problem because there's infinite layers to go into it and really understand and certainly don't feel like, like, like I'm there. But it's I think it's it's probably the the highest, highest expected value used to draw my time.
I don't know if that's the way to any way to say it, but it's it's it's both what I'm my brain is drawn to and naturally wants to think about the most. And what I think just given the nature of the system at the moment, seems like the most prudent thing to be done in real, real time and and effort on so, yeah, it's hopefully that that's a constructive answer.
So Isaac asks, When do you think the next protocol on top of things will be released? Any details of what's in the works?
Well, it's hard to say, because it largely depends on what you mean by on top of being. And if you mean developed in the Bienstock ecosystem, hopefully there will be some stuff rolling out. One, I'm not sure if it'll be different protocols or upgrades to the current protocols. I know that there are some other cool projects like irrigation and only be that are being worked on that.
To be honest, we have we have no information on whatsoever other than what's been released to the public. So I don't really have any sense of timing on that front. But those teams seem to be building. So from what we know and don't know but can hope, you know, sometime hopefully early next year, there will be some more stuff getting rolled out.
And objects that sounds like landing and I believe on it is landing protocol. And he asks or senses of the classic if there is any of this on the website.
No no update on this end.
Cassidy emails a couple of minutes.
You can also just come up here, Mr. Nasira the diamond being nft themself.
And uninviting Wozniak and Isaac.
Hello. What's up, homie? How are you doing? I was just some think me.
Oh we I think are cutting out Nasdaq recently.
Yeah. I put the other question in the chat. It was basically just what do you think people can do to help in stock? What do you think we're lacking on what needs to be picked up? So first, there have been a number of unified white hat reports which have illustrated bugs in contracts being stock contracts or associated contracts.
And on the one hand, it's not unexpected, as has been much discussed, any time you're you're dealing with new smart contract code, security should not be assumed as much as it's been audited or looked at and tested. And therefore, there's never any any assumption of security. But with that said, I feel like there really is a balance between pushing, pushing product and and doing it slowly and methodically and to what's been much discussed in previous classes and down meetings, being stocked still has existential threats like you asked, and usdc exposure in at least common denominator fashion, which is the worst of both worlds and therefore there is a balance between moving so fast such that
you're mitigating, you're trying as quickly as possible to mitigate outstanding existential risks, but also without creating new ones. And it on the one hand, that's not a bienstock thing. That's a everyone on an around being stock where more even more attention can be given towards audits. And right now there's only one auditor, one audit firm looking at every bit we can try to find a second high quality audit firm that wants to partner with Beanstalk in a similar way that I think that's much easier said than done.
Trying to get more white hat bounty programs looking at at depths that that that's clearly going to be beneficial to being stock maximizing the probability that white hats find and report bugs before black hats do and exploit them. The those are those are just very basic things. I think one thing that at the margin is a tough pill to swallow, but probably seems like a very prudent thing to do is to have any code even after it's been audited, go through like an a unify white hat review period before it's formally proposed for a couple of weeks, such that even if the down they may be paying for the discovery of the bugs, the bugs
themselves aren't aren't practicable or practicable on chain. And so the goal is to find as many things in advance as possible without stopping the progression that is necessary in order to try to get get been stuck away from as many of the the existential risk that can be mitigated at the moment. So that's I don't know if that can be doing better, but it's a process then that that everyone working on Beanstalk can probably do better at and know that there's a there's there's a lot of, of, of work being done on that process at the moment.
I think another thing that would be would be great would be the implementation of SERAPH. The Beanstalk Service Committee has been doing a lot of what's let's try to get that up and running hopefully end of the year or so that'll be proposed to the Dow. And then both of those two items can continue to improve the security of the protocol.
But otherwise, I think there is a question as to as to whether it's good or not to have more eyes. On the one hand, in general, sure, more ideas are better than last size. But it's it's really important to understand the context that being stock that's operating in right now, which is just an absolute bear and therefore there's not a that much capital to go around and B, it's not that much time.
People aren't looking for New Shade to invest it. People are looking to people looking, where can I get my cat? So the concept that right now at the margin, the thing that the inside needs to be doing is bringing in more farmers or bringing in more eyes. I don't necessarily subscribe to that, but know that that's something that's been echoed throughout throughout the community in various ways.
And I feel like, frankly, it's just a great time to build, which is well, well, what we're trying to do. So at some point when the tech is ready, the market will also be ready. And then, God willing, there will be some serendipity. But until then, you can't kind of got to just control. You can control and don't think that the the the outside looking at Beanstalk is the thing to be focused on at the moment.
But counterintuitive to that, you know, Nasdaq, you ask how can farmers help? That's probably unless you want to get involved and come spend time on the farm and there's lots to do. And as this has been many times said, if you want to come work on the farm, just make it known. And almost certainly for those that our motivated, there's something to be done.
I think at this point the thing that farmers can really do is is just continue to to to to let people know the beanstalk is up and up and running and has responded to the exploit. And just in general, some people are still people that haven't gotten the memo, if you know what I'm saying. So it's a that's something that definitely, I think comes better from from the ground up and people just telling their friends about it as opposed to some sort of coordinated top down.
Let's bring in more people type of thing. So yeah, to to play a little devil's advocate to to the what can beanstalk be doing better and versus how can farmers help. Yeah, it's it's not really on on beanstalk to attract people but I think it is it's certainly in the interest of people that already have been exposed to to tell their friends what's going on, if that makes up.
Yeah. I mean, actually, that was my next question. Like, do you even want media attention or like Twitter attention or did you just want to focus on building? So I guess you answered that. I guess I've started seeing like some Twitter people who were talking about the before the exploit and then stopped. One or two of them have started talking about again.
I just like the vibe from thinking about like last Thanksgiving versus this Thanksgiving is like last Thanksgiving felt extremely energetic and like full of possibility. I guess there's a lot of you know, there's a lot of things coming down the pipeline. It's just that I feel like some of those people got burned and and are having a tough time talking about it.
So I don't know. It's not really a question. I'm just kind of commenting on the general vibe. I think, yeah.
Maybe one thing Nasdaq is the I understand there's a correlation between new farmers and then, let's say, you know, increase in supply. And as that's probably said in this market and with what's happening, maybe this is maybe it's probably the time not to build on. And, you know, until you come up with another, let's say, better market conditions.
But it doesn't mean that you still can get, you know, inform people about like what it's doing, explain what being stock is all about, and then, you know, get them, get them. Even as farmers, even if they're not, you know, depositors. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah.
Yeah. So where you come from and Nasdaq, I mean, to your to your point about the the vibes being totally different. The last Thanksgiving, I don't think you're wrong, but at least to me, the things that matter are way better than last Thanksgiving. Like last Thanksgiving, the system is pumping, but the pod it was was also pumping and that was not sustainable.
Whereas you look at right now pot rates decreasing. And the the I mean, the pot rate is much higher than it was last Thanksgiving. But beans are has a real history behind it at this point. So we'll see how it goes. But at least to me, yeah, there's all the joy and jubilation around being men. That's kind of the that's like the given.
It's like, yeah, the system is going to mint at some point. It might not be melting today, but yeah, that's what being starter does. It goes through periods where it means a lot. I think if the the standard by which you're evaluating the success of the system is is it minting right now? Yeah, this is going to be a painful, painful couple, couple of years because it's going to end.
It's going to not meant it's going to mint. It's going to not mint. And that's like a roller coaster of emotions. So I don't know, at least on this. And I feel like the the bigger picture is, is certainly getting painted in a much more detailed manner than than it was painted last Thanksgiving. And, I mean, I remember what you're talking about.
Nasdaq, in fact, I was at the gun range when the system was pumpin and there was a bit it was like $1,000,000 million came in or something. And it was I mean, yeah, there's electric. Electric. I mean, I know exactly what you're talking about. And this Thanksgiving, there's there's no gunpowder. At least it feels like the market's out of gunpowder, if you will.
So I hear that. But I think that I think that the the whole game has just matured, so much so that even the concept of evaluating the minutes of the thing by which we're going to judge that the energy that's right to me and the energy is around. There's betting happening and there's actual utility. It's exogenous from the protocol that's electric.
It's a little bit less electric than $1,000,000 being by market by and then hundreds of thousands of mints. But it's it's going to build back up to that and then some at some point, God willing. And I think if if you're if you're in a rush to get there, we're never going to get there. So instead, we got to we got to just focus on the process and not worry about the the day to day and the hope that the process is good enough.
Yeah. Once once again, you kind of beat me to it as I was going to say, this time around, it feels like we're electric for utility instead of just, you know, people buying pods and lying in their pods to move up. So it's abstracted a little bit. And but if that's not better, I mean, come on. That's way that.
No, I don't know. I'm I'm agreeing that it is better that utility is coming through way better that the demand is for utility and even for pure speculation. I mean, at the end of the day, some someone maybe it was even you made a good point about it in organic demand and how that's kind of like a fun term that we've used and think that there is a difference between speculative demand and inorganic demand demand to be speculative and organic or speculative in and organic.
And yeah, this is a very different type of man. It's perhaps not speculative in nature at all. It's more utility based demand and definitely a different, different way of going about it. Now, maybe it maybe it would have been better for from the get go. There was utility for billions, but obviously Rome wasn't built in a day. So I feel like at this point just got to be excited for those little couple couple of hundred bean mints that were then minted for roots and then used and paired up.
That should be really cool. So hopefully at some point that'll compound. But for now, yeah, I'm not going to be enjoying my Thanksgiving turkey any less. That's fair. That sounds good. Thank you. Thank you, homie. Appreciate you coming up and know that you at least think from your messages can tell that you've been a little frustrated and just want to want to send some love and you know no no no no that we're all on the same team here.
And it's if we if we knew all the right answers, we'd share them. But unfortunately, don't know. Don't know either. And just trying to figure this out together. No, I agree. I appreciate it. I think I think maybe it's the frustration of of being right at the right at the front and just wanting a little, little pump. And yeah, you're you're you're not going to dump on.
It was back when you met right I don't I don't know I mean what lesson to that I know that's the joke right for everyone. Yeah YouTube video. I don't think you can make a second video. I did it again, guys. So yeah, again, that is kind of the point of beanstalk that when your pods harvest, it does want you to sell.
So yeah, yeah. It's a, it's a very symbiotic system. So with, with that in mind, God willing, your pods harvest soon enough, my friend. Appreciate it. Have a good Thanksgiving. Happy Thanksgiving, brother.
Thank you. As you like. The next question is from presents probably. And they ask who's calling the holidays?
I don't know. But they sold a couple of thousand beans this week, so we don't know. But there's at least one or two bots that are competitively calling the phone right. It'll be more interesting once the Dutch auctions are implemented.
Yeah. And any any idea when that can be expected?
It's under audit, but not not sure. And to our to our earlier conversation about slowing down the the dev process with the bug bounties in the yard, it may not be until Q1 that it actually goes out.
No reason to rush things.
Yeah. Considering that's not even like there's no existential risk that's being alleviated through that depth. Certainly.
Okay. We would actually, I think almost on top of the hours at the end of the tunnel questions and always thank you all for joining us today on Happy Thanksgiving to everyone and see you next week.
Happy Thanksgiving around.